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Started by fjordrage on Jun 3, 2015 2:57:53 AM
The South China Sea

Growing attention on the area as US increases military presence to challenge Chinese policies.

The Philippines Senate, which had voted in 1991 against renewing the lease on US bases, has dropped its objection to the American return to waters threatened by China’s new insistence on its right to rule almost all the South China Sea – including the Spratly Islands claimed by the Philippines, Vietnam, Malaysia and Brunei.

fjordrage - 03 Jun 2015 03:13:44 (#1 of 1458)

The increasingly acrimonious relations between Beijing and Washington over the vast area of ocean indicate a rising role for the US – in defence of not only the Philippines’ stake in the waters but also of Vietnam, where 40 years ago the US was ousted in a war for which Subic Bay provided strategic support. On Monday, fresh from proclaiming the right of US ships and planes to move unmolested in waters and airspace claimed by China, the US Defence Secretary Ashton Carter was in Hanoi, listening to a Vietnamese band play “The Star Spangled Banner” and declaring: “We’re both committed to deepening our defence relationship.”

fjordrage - 03 Jun 2015 09:17:09 (#2 of 1458)

In an effort to stoke nationalism and distract its people from a slowing economy, the Chinese government has been acting particularly aggressively in the South China Sea, engaging in territorial disputes with neighbors including Japan.This is one of the most dangerous games in the world.

For over a year China has been diligently building islands on top of reefs in the South China Sea, reclaiming 2,000 acres of land. In April, satellite imagery showed that the Chinese military had built an airstrip big enough for military aircraft.

The government has been loud about it, too, declaring its right to reclaim the Spratly Islands, the land around the reefs, on historical grounds.

The Global Post, a state tabloid owned by party publication The People's Daily, wrote that any attempt by the US to stop China from building out parts of the South China Sea would inevitably end in war.

Intowntonight - 04 Jun 2015 18:53:04 (#3 of 1458)

Isnt it ironic re Vietnam ?

Whilst in Vietnam earlier this year, the Chinese are the last people the Vietnamese seem to want to do business with:

they prefer other Asians - Japan in particular (ironic), the US (ironic) and the EU (ironic):

the large cities and resorts are full of US and EU brands.

If someone in the State Dept in the 1960s had bothered to look, the Vietnamese are not too fond of the Chinese who they have seen historically as regional hegemonists. If you look around Vietnam, most of the statues and monuments are to Vietnamese leaders who defeated or rebuffed the Chinese in previous centuries.

fjordrage - 08 Jun 2015 11:15:28 (#4 of 1458)

BEIJING (Reuters) - One of China's top military officers left for an official visit to the United States on Monday, the Defense Ministry said, amid tension between the two countries over the South China Sea and cybersecurity.

Fan Changlong, who is a deputy head of the powerful Central Military Commission, is on a "friendly" visit at the invitation of U.S. Defense Secretary Ash Carter, and will also visit Cuba, China's Defense Ministry said in a brief statement

fjordrage - 09 Jun 2015 03:38:43 (#5 of 1458)

Malaysia announced on Monday, June 8th that it will protest the intrusion of a Chinese Coast Guard ship into its territorial waters north of Borneo, a rare confrontational statement in the growing tensions in the South China Sea.

machiavelli - 09 Jun 2015 08:18:21 (#6 of 1458)

It's Chinese for "Come and 'ave a go if you think yer hard enough".

fjordrage - 10 Jun 2015 23:12:33 (#7 of 1458)

CANBERRA -- What exactly is America's gripe with China in the South China Sea? The question becomes more and more important as the future of the world's most vital bilateral relationship becomes more and more dependent on what happens in this much-contested waterway. And the answer is not very clear.

From Beijing's perspective, the more China presses U.S. allies and defies U.S. criticism with impunity, the further the credibility of U.S. leadership in Asia falls, and the more China's claims to regional leadership are enhanced.

brooklyn - 11 Jun 2015 02:03:24 (#8 of 1458)

I think it's pretty clear. you can't build an artificial island in an area of sea lanes, put air force planes on it, and claim that you have rights to restrict traffic. military or commercial. even the huffpo article assumes china is eager to restrict military traffic, and merely hopes it will not restrict commercial traffic.

what's with this theory that building an artificial island creates a zone of control the way Oahu or Kyushu would?

toffle - 11 Jun 2015 02:27:51 (#9 of 1458)

There are islands there already, they're just very small.

GyratingTrampoline - 11 Jun 2015 07:34:51 (#10 of 1458)

Isn't it basically down to Taiwan and the US still being sore about the communists winning the civil war?

sugarsnappeas - 11 Jun 2015 07:47:51 (#11 of 1458)

And Malaysia, Vietnam, Philippines, etc. try again.

Intowntonight - 11 Jun 2015 20:51:42 (#12 of 1458)

and Thailand & Indonesia.

toffle - 11 Jun 2015 21:14:43 (#13 of 1458)

In fact, Taiwan and PRoperChina are in approximate agreement about most Chinese territorial claims (There are quite a few), hence the Taiwanese presence here, in the Great South China Sea Artificial Islands Territorial Grab Clusterfuck.

It's who is the legitimate government of China (and its various claimed territories) that they are in dispute about.

FGBFGB - 11 Jun 2015 21:16:59 (#14 of 1458)

The RoC would also like to regain Mongolia, Tannu Tuva and the Amur Provinces. Or did until quite recently.

sugarsnappeas - 11 Jun 2015 21:21:48 (#15 of 1458)

Amur Provinces

Very entertaining book, the Amur Tiger is quite a machine. book also talks about some of the history of that area:

sugarsnappeas - 11 Jun 2015 21:22:15 (#16 of 1458)

<<< now back to your regularly scheduled thread >>>

SinnerBoy - 14 Jun 2015 16:14:27 (#17 of 1458)


The RoC would also like to regain Mongolia, Tannu Tuva and the Amur Provinces. Or did until quite recently.

They claim about a third of Kazakhstan, as well. At the turn of the century, they forced Kazakhstan to cede several hundred kilometres square of territory along their border. Atlases at schools (my Kazakh nephew spent 2 years at high school, in Beijing) show the Chinese border extending well into Kazakhstan, with no comments, or different shading, indicating a disputed territory.

fjordrage - 15 Jun 2015 18:25:49 (#18 of 1458)

Last week’s test was the fourth one China has conducted in just 18 months, suggesting it is a priority of China’s military. The Wu-14, which can carry nuclear or conventional warheads, can travel at ten times the speed of sound, or 7,680 miles per hour. Its maneuverability enables it to bypass U.S. missile defense systems.

This point was underscored by He Qisong, a defense expert at the Shanghai University of Political Science and Law. Speaking to the SCMP, He said that “The Wu-14 … is designed to penetrate US missile defence systems, meaning the PLA is capable of defending China's territorial sovereignty."

He added: "But such a test is only a nuclear deterrence. Neither China nor the U.S. wants to declare war over the South China Sea issues."

tasselhoff - 15 Jun 2015 18:27:05 (#19 of 1458)

IOW, don't fuck with us, Imperialist Running Dog scum!

Intowntonight - 15 Jun 2015 18:58:41 (#20 of 1458)

But keep buying our stuff

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