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Started by chacqueschirac on Jun 6, 2021 3:43:46 PM
"to defend our democratic values, which we cannot separate from our interests"
Atticus - 06 Jun 2021 15:49:10 (#1 of 38)

Without reading the article it suggests a recognition that values don't always run in line with interests but that in this case the value should be the interest.

bailliegillies - 07 Jun 2021 09:54:52 (#2 of 38)

He missed some words out.

Insert "own self" between our and interests. Every empire since the beginning has been ruled by the self interest of the ruling elite, Washington, the beacon on the hill is no different.

TauCeti - 07 Jun 2021 18:10:33 (#3 of 38)

A way to say he is prepared to bomb somebody?

chacqueschirac - 07 Jun 2021 21:57:47 (#4 of 38)

To defend democratic values?

brooklyn - 07 Jun 2021 22:12:28 (#5 of 38)

I am unsurprised that you seem unfamiliar with the concept of "democratic values."

if you like, I can recommend some books for you. on that, and also on foreign policy matters. and how they are conceptually different, whether they should be or not.

GyratingTrampoline - 07 Jun 2021 22:18:42 (#6 of 38)

I took the phrase "our democratic values, which we cannot separate from our interests" to mean that he sees US interests as being aligned with democratic values, in the sense that the US would prefer a world in which democracy is thriving.

Its a hypocritical position because longstanding US foreign policy often does not align with democratic values and there's no indication that Biden has any intention of altering this in any significant way.

Presumably that's why chaques started this thread, since he seems to enjoy railing against the US

brooklyn - 08 Jun 2021 00:54:59 (#7 of 38)

the article seems a bit different from that. it does not criticize Biden on the theory that he has democracy at home, but does not really care if democracy exists abroad. it suggests that he has democracy problems at home, while he promotes democracy abroad.

chacqueschirac - 08 Jun 2021 06:29:25 (#8 of 38)

The article clearly implies that the old man thinks that “democractic values” are just that which the US deems fit for its own selfish purposes, as bailliegillies suggested.

Snook1 - 08 Jun 2021 08:16:55 (#9 of 38)

Clearly , you have an agenda . Have you ever even been to the US ? Or do you base your opinions on someone else's opinion that " clearly implies that the old man ( do you gets extra for attempted childish insults?) thinks that " ( hard evidence there). That was after you quoted a line in a quote of the article with " WTF is that supposed to mean ?" Sad. Bait much?

chacqueschirac - 08 Jun 2021 08:26:07 (#10 of 38)


brooklyn - 08 Jun 2021 15:56:32 (#11 of 38)

#8 shows that you have reading comprehension problems, as always. in addition, "the old man" sounds pretty ageist to me.

guigal - 12 Jun 2021 09:33:59 (#12 of 38)

Democrats at home, savages abroad. The Western democracies destroy and tyrannize countries around the world. The fact that we have political freedoms and superior living standards in our own countries, isn't much consolation to people we've reduced to misery in Iraq, Libya Palestine and everywhere where we support chaos and oppression for our own purposes.

AdrianNTierney - 12 Jun 2021 13:46:45 (#13 of 38)

#12 implies that such "tyrannized" countries have no agency of their own whatsoever.

So one could quite rightly accuse guigal of denigrating the humanity of such peoples.


chacqueschirac - 05 Jul 2021 22:18:33 (#14 of 38)

Democrats at home, savages abroad.

That, and Democracy geared for the few.

AdonisBlue - 05 Jul 2021 22:21:27 (#15 of 38)

#13 the racism of low expectations.

AdrianNTierney - 05 Jul 2021 23:15:43 (#16 of 38)

the racism of low expectations.

Which is Chalk's favored rhetorical tactic, not mine, eh?

chacqueschirac - 12 Jul 2021 08:41:26 (#17 of 38)

Some research from North Korea on the subject:

“According to the North Korean researcher, the United States employs foreign aid as a “political tool for subordinating other countries politically and economically.” He notes that in many cases, Washington actually ends up “raking in money” by securing advantageous economic or political conditions in exchange for such “trivial” humanitarian assistance.”

Tadagee - 12 Jul 2021 08:43:13 (#18 of 38)

North Korean research reported in RT.

Top class trolling.

RosyLovelady - 12 Jul 2021 08:50:10 (#19 of 38)

I don't watch RT but I know that literally everything it says is LIES. I read it here.

Tadagee - 12 Jul 2021 09:26:18 (#20 of 38)

Yeah but...research from North Korea? Academic freedom there might be slightly...aspirational.

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